Jane Parks new VC

Congrats to Jane!

The other day I noticed that Jane Parks of NJ was appointed as the new West Vice Chair to fill the vacant spot. It is very nice to see the first woman as a VC to the committee. I am sure Jane will do a wonderful job.

Was there really no one willing and able to be VC who actually lives in the West?

In my opinion the VC should live in the territory they cover. Same should be true of State Certifiers. These leadership people really need to be in touch and accessible with their respective coverage areas. Being local makes the process of getting a course certified attainable for that struggling novice measurer when the paperwork goes in state rather than across the country. True too for State Certifiers and FS’s when kicking up to the VC.

While I have been encouraged by the more recent version of the RRTC, Jane’s appointment and some of the recent State and FS appointments seem too similar to the less inclusive ways of the past. Having too many people agreeing and thinking alike does not help an organization to continue to move forward. RRTC has come a long way in the last few years, but these types of appointments take two steps backwards. The RRTC can be and should always strive to be so much more.

Kevin is correct about Regional Certifiers being in the State they represent. However, this is not always possible as there may not be a qualified person to do the job. RRTC always tries to find that person if possible.

It was not a question if there was a person in the West to be VC for the West. I took suggestions from Duane and he felt Jane would be the best fit. We live in the electronic age and this position is not like someone living in a state they represent. Their job is very different than a Regional certifier.

I guess we need to change the titles of our Vice Chairs from West/East to just Vice Chairs. Why not have three Vice Chairs as their jobs have become more difficult over the years.

RRTC position appointments are made based on suggestions from the Council. These are made based on one's past work and their ability to get along with people.

I served as VC West for several years, and before me was Mike Wickiser. Not living in the West never seemed to be much of a hindrance, and this was before the era of electronic submissions.

As I said right off the top in my earlier post, I am sure Jane will do a wonderful job. Getting the job done isn’t the issue for me. I agree with Jim Gerweck pointing out about himself or Mike Wickiser doing the VC West job. Changing the VC titles might be the simple answer like Gene Newman suggests. In that case the West or East location expectation is completely removed. Who cares then if a VC lives east or west of the Mississippi? Good solution Gene!

If out of state certifiers is a problem, what can be done to correct it? Currently there are 26 states with out of state Certifiers. Could switching to the present 57 USATF Association territories help? Adopting Association territories would follow more closely with population bases. Maybe key people with an Association could be more easily identified to be tutored as a certifier? How about increasing the 30 year old course certification fee from $30 max to $50? Increasing the certification fee would naturally expand the number of people who consider the certifier duties.

As a point of accuracy, I was VC East not West.
I was Washington State Certifier from 2006 to 2009. During that time I made friends and believe I was an effective and efficient certifier.
Over the years it has been proposed that the Certification become an Association function. This has ALWAYS been turned down because the Associations do not have the expertise to handle course certifications. It is not any improvement to have a local certifier who doesn't understand the program over someone who has spent years measuring courses and gaining a wealth of experience.
I agree that it is better to have an experienced local certifier than a remote one but that experienced certifier doesn't need to be local to serve the state effectively.

Personally, I would be opposed to changing to Association configuration for where to send applications. State boundaries are clear, and many measurers are not members of USATF. Non-members would have to do more searching to figure out where to send paperwork.

If there is a third VC position created, that is when we can drop "West" and "East". No need to do it before a third is created. Location of the VC is irrelevant. It may take one or two extra days for snail mail to get somewhere, but that is yet another incentive to submit digitally.

I oppose raising the fee from $30 to $50. Yes, it takes time to train measurers, but once they are trained well, it does not take an inordinate amount of time to review applications. The key is in proper training of the measurers, and sticking to published standards for procedures, and map production. Some certifiers are not diligent in guiding measurers to the quidelines, so it takes them longer to process paperwork. That is the consequence of not enforcing published standards from the first submission.

Just my opinions, having worn all the hats except Chairman.

Kevin, you tried to shift the RRTC to Associations years ago. To support this, facts were misrepresented to paint a poor view of the RRTC and it's effectiveness. In doing so people were hurt and controversy reigned.
Different opinions are always welcomed but this subject has been hashed over adequately.

Kevin,

Mike clearly stated it as you presented this idea before
and it was rejected for many reasons.

Kevin, thanks for expressing your view.

For clarity here, Gene wrote: “ Kevin is correct about Regional Certifiers being in the State they represent”. The problem has been identified. We can reasonably discuss possible fixes. The Association territory idea is an idea that works effectively for USATF Officials. It’s just a possible solution.

I don’t understand the push/pull love/ hate relationship with the USATF when the RRTC is a Council of USATF? I still maintain the RRTC has come a long way over the years.

1. Jane will make an excellent administrator as the West Vice Chair.
2. In this day and age, the Vice Chairs could be anywhere in the world.
3. Shifting any control to the Associations will only open up the door to political involvement and ultimately wrong decisions. Comparing this to what is done with officials is apples and oranges. Save the drama and your energy - it will not happen, I will bet the farm on this!

Congratulations, Jane!

Welcome Jane and Congratulations!
Duane, sorry to see you leaving the VC position.

When I started working in what became RRTC, we all worked for Ted Corbitt. It felt as though we were all like-minded people who believed that it was a good thing for courses to be accurate. Ted exerted very little actual supervision.

This changed a bit when RRTC was formed. We had structured organization, with a chairman, two vice-chairs, and a few other officers. These people were chosen somewhat informally, and the people who did the choosing were the certifiers. The sole exception to this was the office of Chairman. It has always been chosen by others in the USATF hierarchy.

I was one of the first chairmen, and I liked what we were doing. It felt useful, and we certifiers were free to operate governed by a general consensus among us of how things should be run.

As time went by, we began to have to interface with the Records Committee, and to become involved in things which required political activity. I found that this made my job less satisfactory. I think some of the others may have been similarly affected. I was interested in making courses accurate and had little interest in other technical aspects of road running.

The idea that certifiers should be organized within the association structure horrifies me. Each certifier would have more work to do, as their association would have chores for them, such as measuring important association races. Greater inroads on the certifiers’ time would be made. Also, some associations are more efficient than others. Linking us to the associations would fragment our duties as certifiers. Would we have an RRTC chairman to help us decide how to approach a problem, or would we answer to the desires of our individual associations? Who knows?

All I know is that I prefer that we be an autonomous body working within USATF, and that we be ruled by ourselves. Few in USATF know the details of what we do, and to have uninformed people voting on how we should do our job is not attractive.

As I am no longer active in RRTC it won’t gore my ox if we get farther into political, as opposed to technical, work. But I would hate to see it happen.

Welcome, Jane!

This discussion sounds too similar to the recent Fox News Republican Debates. Lots of discussion about what doesn’t work, but absolutely no suggestions for what might work.

Not saying to turn the RRTC over to the Associations! I agree, Associations are sometimes a political mess. What I am pointing to is what currently works for USATF Officials within individual Associations as a model to look at. Is there something they are doing to recruit officials the RRTC might also do to recruit State Certifiers?

Thanks to so many for the warm welcome. Stepping in after Duane is a tough act to follow. Many thanks to Duane and Gene for their help on getting me up to speed (although I am still on the learning curve).

I am also a member of the NJ Association Board of Trustees and the Women's Chair of our Long Distance Running Committee. The Associations all have their own individual ways of recruiting. The NJ Association is still looking to fill a critical board position that has been open for months. Ultimately, the special skills required for the job outweigh location and other preferred, not necessarily essential, criteria for filling a position in the NJ association.
However, it is always good to look at new and/or different views. I think Gene has made some very positive changes in the RRTC operations to accommodate the increased need for good measurers, Final Signatories, and Certifiers.

I look forward to working with the RRTC in my new position.

BTW Thanks to all for not making me sell my house and go west. :-)

Jane

I'd like to add my welcome and congratulations to Jane, and my sadness to see Duane go. Watch out for those "real" jobs, they can swallow you up if you're not careful!

I don't know about other areas but around here we need more measurers AND more officials.

I don't really want to get involved with our local association, too much feuding and politics. But maybe it wouldn't hurt to show up and appeal for folks to give measuring (and officiating) a try.