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Reply to "Should a Certified Course be removed for non-payment"

Measurers pay certifiers a modest fee for every submission. Certifiers pay RRTC/USATF a small fee for every submission. If we consider that measurers pay certifiers and RRTC from the funds they charge clients for the overall service we jointly provide, then it seems to me to follow that RRTC is indeed part of the process. The pieces of the process are and should be transparent to clients. I do not believe measurers elect to submit courses for certification out of his/her personal budget. Therefore, RRTC takes a piece of every fee a measurer receives for his/her work and is part of the revenue stream for each submission, in my view.

If measurers were not required to pay for certifications, I personally would view this differently. RRTC obviously IS involved in the revenue stream, however modest that revenue may be. I agree that volunteer officers and certifiers do not need to get involved in disputes about this, whether we regard our clients as "third parties" or something else. I believe Duane is just saying that, if a certifier (or measurer) requests a certification be taken down from USATF, we should be able to do it. I do not believe anyone is suggesting RRTC/USATF get involved or entertain any involvement beyond that. Anyway, what RD would have the chutzpah to stiff a measurer and then complain to RRTC/USATF that his/her course map/certificate does not appear on the site? I do not think any further action would be requested by a measurer or anyone else. If it is too difficult to take down a map and a certificate once in a blue moon, then my opinion is moot.

I agree with Gene that the invoicing and payment arrangement must be made by the measurer up front - and that this should prevent any non-payment situations. I used Duane's billing system as a starting point for creating my 2-page agreement I require every client to sign and return to me with a deposit before I start work. Getting that signature and deposit seems to put my clients on notice that they are engaging in a business contract, not some proposal to volunteer. The agreement all my clients sign states "upon delivery of balance due, RR (service provider) will immediately deliver your course map and certificate with your USATF certification number".

I had way too many slow payers (several months for some) in years past before I instituted this system. I now offer a PayPal option to clients. For me, it is worth the small piece PayPal takes for me to receive the funds in my account quickly.

I learned by accident 2 years ago that one of my certifiers got stiffed for measuring a 5K and a 10K for one client. After a year, his calls and emails went unanswered. He gave up. Then, this same RD contacted me for race day logistics work. I told her she had to clear up the bill from the course measuring before work could start. She paid my certifier immediately. I told her I needed cash in advance to start work. She happily complied. There are these types out there - mercifully few, I hope.
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